tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post3702889588229076221..comments2023-05-16T07:11:23.125-07:00Comments on Preposterous Twaddlecock: How to Deal with Writers Effectively in One Easy LessonRayGartonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09973158405226955253noreply@blogger.comBlogger86125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-15064228210110357142017-05-24T21:07:33.858-07:002017-05-24T21:07:33.858-07:00Standing ovation, Ray! Thank you for sharing this....Standing ovation, Ray! Thank you for sharing this. And now *I* am going to share this link / post with others who need to see it -- and UNDERSTAND it. Write on, brother. I certainly will . . . and for a paycheck, too. Thanks for all your wonderful stories, and cheers!Kerryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02063654019863322414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-17749142299978392192015-05-21T18:38:33.457-07:002015-05-21T18:38:33.457-07:00Keep telling yourself that.Keep telling yourself that.RayGartonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09973158405226955253noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-62829604906923926962015-05-21T17:58:27.312-07:002015-05-21T17:58:27.312-07:00Fucking A, Ray. absolutely spot on.Fucking A, Ray. absolutely spot on.Harry Shannonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14811646117445546227noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-59353436705568461782015-05-21T09:14:32.841-07:002015-05-21T09:14:32.841-07:00Yes! This. I turn down a lot of appearance request...Yes! This. I turn down a lot of appearance requests for this reason.S. J. Reisner || Audrey Brice || S. Connollyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03066439838578086766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-82287018959325712012015-05-21T07:05:51.266-07:002015-05-21T07:05:51.266-07:00Being around with musicians and working with model...Being around with musicians and working with models ... this complaint isn't unique to writers. Non-creatives want creative product -- they don't want to pay for creative product. When pressed, they insinuate it is easy or they could get anyone to do it.<br /><br />Ask a musician or model how often they are asked to do something for free "for the exposure". Insert cynical laugh emoticons here.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18079587376249347830noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-19754850208555442652014-08-28T01:15:51.946-07:002014-08-28T01:15:51.946-07:00Great article!
I totally agree with you Ray!
No...Great article!<br /> <br />I totally agree with you Ray!<br /><br />No novel that takes a six months to a year to write should be bought for as little as $3000. Publishers should offer at least twice as much as that for a for a new writer and much more for one with over 20 years experience!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-59284402537400522062012-09-08T03:07:51.391-07:002012-09-08T03:07:51.391-07:00David, You're spot on! Thanks for sharing this...David, You're spot on! Thanks for sharing this. Lynne (Garindein, France)Lynne Copelandnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-24891910833725122242012-09-06T15:34:14.003-07:002012-09-06T15:34:14.003-07:00A standing ovation, sir! Well done, well done ind...A standing ovation, sir! Well done, well done indeed!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723876435090409807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-91691077756485390752012-09-06T15:30:47.088-07:002012-09-06T15:30:47.088-07:00You are my hero, Ray! Thanks for this.You are my hero, Ray! Thanks for this.Carson Buckinghamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17135116985664988012noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-63068044243264914492012-06-28T11:47:09.665-07:002012-06-28T11:47:09.665-07:00I think Ellison's view might be a little extre...I think Ellison's view might be a little extreme. I remember him (vaguely) complaining that someone had asked him to do a free interview for use as a DVD extra. That doesn't sound that bad to me, assuming he gets royalties for DVD sales of the episode he wrote. (I don't have the interview handy to check.) Now if other people are getting paid for *their* interviews, or if he doesn't otherwise get paid for the DVDs, then he certainly has a point, but if not, I think he's being unnecessarily ornery and short-sighted. If the DVD royalties are higher than the syndication royalties, then it's in his interest to add value to the DVDs. People want an excuse to buy the set. Give 'em one.David Cardinalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-22469032959654260282012-06-28T11:41:18.804-07:002012-06-28T11:41:18.804-07:00I don't see a problem with taking a contributo...I don't see a problem with taking a contributor copy as payment. If a new novel that took a year to write is worth only, say, 3,000 dollars, then 30 dollars (or a thirty-dollar item) might be fair payment for a 30-page short story.<br /><br />That is, if it's a book you would have actually *bought* if you couldn't get it for free.<br /><br />(If you wouldn't have bought and read the thing unless your own story was in it, then you've basically been paid with a giant paperweight.)<br /><br />I don't think professional writers should be that worried about no-name newbies. If they're giving their stuff away, it might not be that big a deal. No one has ever heard of them! Now if James Patterson and Stephen King started giving their stuff away, that would be a problem. Already I've seen new hardcover novels by Michael Crichton, Dean Koontz, and Stephen King sold for just $9 each. If you're a lesser-known writer, it might be hard to get people to spend $8 on your new paperback if they can get a future #1 bestseller, in hardcover, for just a dollar more.David Cardinalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-39663970972344660912012-06-28T10:58:28.386-07:002012-06-28T10:58:28.386-07:00It's interesting that some people think the pu...It's interesting that some people think the publisher gets paid by the writer. I think the majority of people are sort of the opposite: they assume all published novelists are millionaires.<br /><br />(Also, if you *pay* to get published, you basically *are* the publisher.)<br /><br />I'm bothered by aspiring writers who don't like to read. If you have no interest in reading other writers' books, what makes you think anyone will be interested in yours?<br /><br />I don't think the Olympic swimmer analogy really applies to those guys, though -- he *is* interested in writing (swimming) but not interested in reading (um, watching people swim) -- but I do think it accurately describes the earlier guy, the writer who wasn't interested in grammar or spelling.<br /><br />A related point is that I don't think aspiring writers should be so eager to get another writer's input. Professional writers aren't their target audience. They need to get input from the type of people whom might actually buy their books. It's probably better to get input from a big group of regular readers than to get input from one professional. On the one hand, the other writer probably is (or was) a fan of the genre he writes in, and he's gained valuable experience, but on the other hand, he probably won't have the same sensibility, the same mindset, as your target audience.<br /><br />Thinking spelling and grammar are completely unimportant is just ridiculous, but I do think "real" writers value things in a different proportion than ordinary readers. People piss all over the prose of Stephenie Meyer and Dan Brown, but they write bestselling books. I haven't read them, but my instinct is that a highly entertaining book shouldn't be considered "bad" even if its writing is somewhat sloppy.<br /><br />My point is: why bother being a pain in some writer's ass when the guy down the block might be an equally effective guinea pig?David Cardinalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-52917146139605207172012-06-28T09:55:19.390-07:002012-06-28T09:55:19.390-07:00I usually don't mind a little snarkiness now a...I usually don't mind a little snarkiness now and then, but I'm pretty sure he was joking.David Cardinalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-72314964029463056632012-06-27T23:04:26.747-07:002012-06-27T23:04:26.747-07:00Great piece, Ray. Writers should insist that they...Great piece, Ray. Writers should insist that they be paid for their work, period. If someone wants to publish your work for free, or for 'contributors copies'? <br /><br />Congratulations, you've just decided what your work is worth.<br /><br />If you're thinking that publishing for free will give you "exposure"? It won't... at least not in any way that will ultimately benefit you, "benefit" defined as, 'one day being compensated for your work.'<br /><br />Same with "spec" publishing in an anthology wherein you as author/contributor receive no upfront payment and only a percentage of payment... sometime later... maybe?<br /><br />It's enough to contend with a publishing model that shortchanges writers and the "free content" model wherein people will happily pay for their content-viewing devices but expect what they then view to be 'free'. Writers are already ripped off... you as a writer do not need to rip yourself off.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-56663717077779269492012-06-27T20:15:20.371-07:002012-06-27T20:15:20.371-07:00Bravo!Bravo!Tamara Thornehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18200874129561106147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-38463402684295376102012-06-27T16:21:13.096-07:002012-06-27T16:21:13.096-07:00I think the situation has got worse since the eboo...I think the situation has got worse since the ebook explosion with desperate and impatient self-published writers giving away their work for free. Unscrupulous would be anthology publishers rely on that seam of panic and desperation to fill their tomes with freebie stories.<br />We all know it takes time, patience and bloody hard work to develop and hone your craft, accept and learn from the inevitable rejections. Once you are a professional writer, damn right you should be paid!Raven Danehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11202094238683478992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-15198475234024362532012-05-15T10:22:49.768-07:002012-05-15T10:22:49.768-07:00First of all I want to apologize for my absence, t...First of all I want to apologize for my absence, though I doubt anyone noticed. It seems that while I love my brand new smartphone, it is hard to discuss and post, especially on Facebook. (Doug from Facebook) I cant even figure how to share stuff on your page anymore. Anyway. I commented on this post a while back and while I believe my reasons were sound, I think they paid off. I have a contract for my novella that I was completing when I previously posted. There is no up front money but there are quarterly royalties on both the paperback sales and e book sales. Obviously I am no Ray Garton, nor will I ever be, and I say that without an ounce of sarcasm, nevertheless I am happy about this first step. The percentages that they offered are fair, and I was free to set price point for e books but chose to keep that low as I wanted to maximize sales. A recent E ZINE I was published in offered no pay but did provided a full page ad and copy as payment, and think it may be worth doing again when my novella comes out in Sept. To me it was a means to an end, and while my book is not yet in print, my contract seems to prove that my reasoning, has paid off. For me anyway.Douglas Vance Castagnahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12160774870123881331noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-47879971204095678472012-05-06T20:15:43.045-07:002012-05-06T20:15:43.045-07:00So what do you think about folks that self publish...So what do you think about folks that self publish?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-74487143579333254312012-04-15T15:35:43.595-07:002012-04-15T15:35:43.595-07:00Great article, Ray! There are a lot of people out ...Great article, Ray! There are a lot of people out there sniffing glue.Lee Thompson/Thomas Morgan/James Logan/Julian Vaughnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08961562523377985551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-53818620291982395802012-03-24T03:38:10.375-07:002012-03-24T03:38:10.375-07:00My favourite is those entrepreneurs who, on hearin...My favourite is those entrepreneurs who, on hearing you are a writer say, "we gotta talk!" Then begin to tell you how they need you and you can get in on the ground floor and put in sweat equity and have a share of the zillions their latest scheme will generate, once you write all the copy, the book, the blog, the checks.... Or they hear you also publish books and so they now take up an hour of your day telling you about their book they have just written in 4 exercise books, long hand, that you could data enter for them as they don't type or own a computer and then publish, but they want it in bookstores because the message they have is so vital... been in their heads for years and time to come out and you can be the chosen one.... Sound familiar to anyone?Perry Gamsbyhttp://streetwisepublications.infonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-3717561502673991392012-03-22T02:32:57.627-07:002012-03-22T02:32:57.627-07:00Genius article! Love it! Still laughing! And feeli...Genius article! Love it! Still laughing! And feeling strangely proud :)Frank Coleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04018783970029636432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-22959892950652191812012-03-21T13:26:23.180-07:002012-03-21T13:26:23.180-07:00A professional writer gets paid for his/her work. ...A professional writer gets paid for his/her work. By definition. <br /><br />A writer who does not get paid for his/her work is not a professional. By definition. <br /><br />Being published "for the love" makes you an amateur, not a professional. By definition.<br /><br />If you give away your writing for the "exposure," why should anyone ever pay you for it?<br /><br />Of course, if you have no desire ever to become a professional writer, all the above is moot.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-32034343292161086812012-03-21T13:12:02.857-07:002012-03-21T13:12:02.857-07:00No. It means there won't BE an anthology.No. It means there won't BE an anthology.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-84324891278975250442012-03-20T20:52:16.111-07:002012-03-20T20:52:16.111-07:00I decided to do a random search on Craigslist just...I decided to do a random search on Craigslist just now to see if they had some good examples relating to this discussion. I found these two gems in less than 30 seconds:<br /><br />My Entertainment World is looking for smart and insightful writers to contribute to our website (www.myentertainmentworld.ca) on the topic of Sports, Games (video, computer, board, etc...), Music, TV, Film, Theatre or Books. Editorials, reviews and general articles will be accepted. Please contact kelly@myentertainmentworld.ca for more details or to submit a piece for consideration.<br /><br /> Compensation: no pay <br /><br />I am looking for someone (or people) interested in writing a book review(s). If interested, please email me or call me at 647-220-4200. www.theintelligenceofexcitement.com<br /><br /> Compensation: no pay <br /><br />Awesome opportunities, huh?Timothy Carterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982874914735092331noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1293492602513569232.post-36330182151704617752012-03-20T13:23:00.899-07:002012-03-20T13:23:00.899-07:00Are you telling me that writing advertising copy f...Are you telling me that writing advertising copy for the latest get rich quick scheme, where the person who doesn't want to pay you keeps insisting how they swim on money, doesn't make you all warm and cozy inside?<br />tsk tsk writers today...Irunehttp://copywritingforseo.comnoreply@blogger.com